@AlbanyYEM, I want to quote so many different parts of your last post. Suffice to say some excellent surmisings on your part. I completely agree with everything you had to say there.

You make a great point about the need for Phish to nail their compositions in order for people to "enjoy" them, as opposed to the Dead.

I don't think it's an unfair comparison (Dead vs. Phish playing things straight) in the context of show structure, but you are certainly correct about the the way it felt.

Robert Hunter and John Barlow were lyricists without compare. Let's be honest. The Dead's lyrics were poems that were rooted in Americana as much as the pschedelic scene itself, and many of their songs can be interpreted at so many different levels. I still find myself quoting phrases from Dead songs in my daily life and interactions with others, which speaks to me of the timelessness you speak of. Quite right.

I, for one, prefer Phish to the Dead at this point in my life, and not because they are still vibrant and active. Phish is more jazz-based in their orientation, and I love jazz and jazz arrangements. I love how Phish has morphed jazz, rock and alternative rock together, complete (like the Dead) with quirkiness such as My Sweet One and vacuum solos. In fairness to Phish, then, it must be remembered that the Dead were folk and bluegrass based. Folk is enjoyable on it's own, with or without jamming. Phish has never written an album like American Beauty, and never will.

Phish is generally less serious than the Dead in their tone.

I find these four gentlemen to be superior musicians and Trey is perhaps the best guitar player I've ever heard. He takes me places that Jerry never did, except during about a four-year period between '70-'73.

Anyway, your observations regarding Phish's music are poignant and interesting. They have a lot of songs in their catalog that were written when they were college-aged kids and probably no longer relate with the spirit in which they were written. Just look at the Joy album and the mixed reception its songs have received (even for the ones that are popular in rotation such as Backwards) and the conundrum the band is faced with is significant. How do they not become a greatest hits tour like Furthur? I mean, how?.

I have not been overly impressed with the offerings of the band's new material. Trey's solo album is honestly much more interesting to me than the new stuff from Mike.

If they DON'T focus on style and jamming, their time as band on this earth may come to a swift close. I really believe that they are trying to make the music interesting to themselves again. Hopefully they are succeeding, because it's sure interesting to me.

Anyway, outstanding comments. I think, to make a musical analogy, you have brought this discussion to a satisfying "peak" for me. I like very much the direction of your thoughts on these topics and you have given me some great perspective to consider going forward.